Ben Higgins [00:00:00] But I don't care who you are, you get thrown on a show, it feels exciting, it's a change up in life. I necessarily wasn't prepared for those kind of things. And at first I was like, when my ego was getting bigger and the tension was coming on and I was starting to feel this fame thing, I'm cool, man. Like, you know, I'm not just that normal dude. I've got some swagger. And one of my best buddies, when he called me, he goes, cool, man, now you're just king of the nerds. I was like, yes, dang it. Like, as soon as I started to feel like I was...Had something going I got shut down

Ryan Alford [00:00:31] so and my wife said hey, can I get a picture with I'm like honey He's not gonna be in the office. You know he's gonna be on screen

Ryan Alford [00:00:45] Hey, guys, what's up? It's Ryan Alford, welcome to the latest edition of the Radcast. It's an interesting day for me, my friends. I don't always get to talk about some of my secret pleasures, which I'm going to talk about for a minute. Between my wife and me. We don't have a lot in common, but we do have some secret things. You're going to learn a little bit about me today and some of our interests. Ben Higgins, man for bachelor, author, entrepreneur, I could go on and on with the titles you're now doing. But philanthropists. What's up, brother? 

Ben Higgins [00:01:28] What's up, man? How are you doing?  Good to hear from you. Yeah, those titles are weird. Even when you say them it's like ahh. Yeah You know, we can.

Ryan Alford [00:01:38]  How about two dudes just chatting.

Ben Higgins [00:01:40]  Two guys just hanging out,  trying to make it work in life. 

Ryan Alford [00:01:42] Exactly. That's what we are trying to do, Make it work. What's happening, Ben?  I think a lot of our audience would have at least heard of you. I don't know how many bachelor nation people there are here,  but we're going to find out. I'll find out in our DMs over the coming weeks. How many closets or real Bachelor Nation fans there were. But how are things going? 

Ben Higgins [00:02:06] Things are at a super interesting season of life, and I kind of spoke out about it a couple of weeks ago. I was doing an interview and it was a rough day. And I was kind of talking about how I feel this season of transition, a lot of ways all for the better. The headlines came out and if you Google my name right now, I think what would come out is; I had a breakdown. I did not have a breakdown. I thought I did pretty well. Maybe it comes from my faith, but when I break down things in my life and I transition, usually there's something that breaks through and there's some clarity and there's some movement. It's not always the most fun season, I don't enjoy it all, but I know that it's healthy and it's good. And so I'm going to be healthy and in a good season. But there's a lot of contemplation, there's a lot of things changing, a lot of questions unanswered, and  I don't know the path that's happening right now, but I'm in it and I know something good will come from it now. 

Ryan Alford [00:03:15] It will. And I think it's interesting and it's probably both the blessing and the curse of being you. My wife and I watch every show, every season religiously, and you always stood out as being, a little different as a contestant. I felt like you were one of the first contestants and I think, not only could I have a beer with that guy, but I feel he's real and transparent and always being honest about things. And I bet, the best thing in your curse and those headlines hitting is you get transparent the moment being hit against being you, really you. And maybe it backfires and you are not in some doldrum. 

Ben Higgins [00:03:57] I appreciate that, it is one of the best compliments I could get. We could have a beer together, in fact, it's early in the morning here, we could. But, people bring that up a little bit, and at first, I took it offensively, but you seemed relatable, you seemed like a normal guy. And at first, I was; when my ego was getting bigger and the attention was coming on and I was starting to feel the 'fame' thing, I was like, no, I'm cool, man, but I'm not. Is that normal? Dude, I've got some swagger. And over time I realized I didn't. And I started to enjoy the peace of being able for people to say, ‘hey, I just related with you’ or you did feel different. And I credit all that a lot to my family and my friends, because when I went on and I was announced, The Bachelor, some of my family, friends, and some fans were very excited. My best buddy called me, he goes, ‘Cool, man, you're just king of the nerds’. And I was as soon as I started to feel like I was, I had some go and I got shut out fast. And they have always done that, which has been great because the truth is, I don't think I'm a terrible human, but I'm not that great either and I don't think that my life looks a lot different than most people's. I just happen to get lucky in my mid-twenties and get thrown on a show that changed things forever. 

Ryan Alford [00:05:32]  And I want to get to some of that. But I'll just tell you and maybe pouring on the compliment or being more specific,  I think that relatability is your swagger. That is a swagger. You know, I think the more you get into social media and all the fakeness and everything else that goes with it,  hopefully, you realize that is your true armor. 

Ben Higgins [00:05:59] I'm learning a lot about people and I know we're going to talk about the book in a bit, but I've had a great year of being able to do things that involve a lot of people and hearing a lot of people's stories. And one of the best things about life is, it's not acting like we have everything together and not acting like we have it all figured out and not trying to put on a front to impress the masses, because that's pretty isolating. I think the one thing is just seeing people as equals and also seeing yourself as less than and what that does is allows you to open up your arms to a wider group. But when you find yourself thinking of yourself too high and that you're better, then it's isolating, it's lonely. And at some point that catches up with you. I don't know when some people can hold on to it for a long time, but. Not to go on a tangent here, but there's a great book called Papillon and the author Wright Thompson does this interview with Michael Jordan after he retired and it talks about the transition from being Michael Jordan, the player, to Michael Jordan, the retiree, and how people view him now and how he doesn't get the attention that he once did and what that feels like. And so at some point, it catches up with everybody, so we just want people to be around. 

Ryan Alford[00:07:38] I love that. That's an interesting point. Let's go down that path because what was that like for you? I mean, you're at the pinnacle of awareness and mindset and being the bachelor and being involved with the show. And I will always be attached in some way. But the highs and lows of that are waning a bit.  Was that a challenge? 

Ben Higgins [00:08:04] It is a challenge, I'll say yes. Because I don't care who you are, there are a few factors that play into this that I think are interesting now, as I look back on it, there are a few things. But I don't care who you are, you get thrown on a show, you have lights, you have cameras, you have attention, people are asking about your personal life, they're even diving into your personal life, it feels exciting. It's a change-up in life that I necessarily wasn't prepared for and  I don't know if anybody going on a show is prepared for it. But at the same time, you get all of this attention and I almost had a grievance towards the attention. I think I can be proud of some things I've done since then, but I didn't do anything to get on that show. There is nothing in my life that has prepared me to become a bachelor. I  have no skill sets that  I had worked on and tweaked, I had no practice at this. And so it's hard for me to have a lot of pride, and at some point that hit me that, yes, this is a tidal place in my name. It's a reality television show. My buddy calls me King of the Nerds and this isn't my identity,  it's not who I am. And so then and now especially, is this switch in my mind from being known as a bachelor and having the thing that people most recognize me for as the Bachelor now becoming a husband in a few months and excited for that and releasing that identity completely of being a bachelor and then also knowing that I'm six years out of the show now. And so it's about my leg. It's about what I am going to do with my life that leaves a footprint and an imprint in the world because the bachelor doesn't have much to do with that anymore. 

Ryan Alford [00:10:07] I think that is right, and I never thought about it the way you didn't win. It wasn't like you were a contestant to become The Bachelor. They choose you. I'm sure you applied or someone applied for you, but other than being a good-looking guy and just an everyday guy that seemed to make the cut. But now you look at what you're doing, and I do want to talk about the book 'Alone in plain sight. And I mean, because that's what we're building to in what you're talking about. I mean, let's talk about the book and I think we're diving right into some of the subject matter. 

Ben Higgins  [00:10:45] Yeah. Well, the book came from a journal I've been keeping since college. And I went through some seasons of addiction and depression, some seasons of just confusion, disorientation, not knowing what I was. And so I started journaling down a lot of my thoughts. It was recommended to me by a counselor so I could track what I was thinking and what I was feeling because day-to-day life would be different. And as I got older and I went on the show, I started to write down and note that season of life and my only prayers for how this all turned out, but also just my confusion of what is almost like a dream. Like what am I doing on the cover of People magazine? Well, what is it like to have my family have people show up to their house wondering if they were at home just almost like a dream? It felt odd. I'd say disorienting is the word. I've used it and I continue to use it. And so finally I start to talk about how I feel unlovable. Like I always worry that as people get to know me more, they'll like me less. And I don't know necessarily where that comes from as much as my insecurity and my ego, building into that. But as I started to speak about that, other people started to say; hey, me too. You know something  I held so close to my chest that I never want to talk about, and when I finally talked about it, it was healing for me. But then it was also healing for me to see the masses say; yeah, I'm there, too. And so I got the opportunity to write a book. And I knew this was the message I had to share because I knew the personal struggle with mental health, with addiction, and with feeling isolated. And I thought if I could write a book that would allow others to feel more connected to themselves, to others, to romance, and God, and possibly it would be a benefit to not only myself but maybe somebody else. And so that's where a lot of playing sides came from and it's why it's out there now. It came out just a few months ago, and it's a book not necessarily just about me, but about me and a couple of other people in my life who have had struggles and sorrows, and pains. And I'm hoping that the reader just feels and goes, hey, I'm not alone other people have this too. 

Ryan Alford [00:13:00] What molded you into this person that seems to be grounded in giving back? I talked to a lot of people and they talked about their book and it's I, I, I and I heard you talk more about others. But I'm really curious, where did you feel that guidance, is it just your upbringing in a good Midwestern kid?   Where do you think that's seated? 

Ben Higgins  [00:13:40] Yeah, I think there are a few things, I think the biggest thing is my faith and seeing how my faith has not only disappointed me when it comes to the dealings, especially when I was on the show, like with the church but also saying, OK, if I still believe in Jesus, even with the disappointments that I have with the Christian tradition, then what does that mean? Like what of the things within that, that I know are healthy, that is dear, that Jesus spoke to. And one of those things is having a fear of,  The Lord is my strength. I think the fear has been misinterpreted so many times and the fear the Lord is having just in obedience to loving God and loving others. And so within that, I make that a mission or cry with everything I do. I'm not very smart,  so when I think about making decisions, it really comes down to God is just loving others and then if it is so then I  go do it and so that's one of the reasons.   I just believe that we are meant for community, that we are meant to hold others with high esteem, that we were meant to lift others and to use our gifts and our talents to try to bring something better to this planet, that's one of the things. The other is personally any time I've gone on the path of I, I, I. It's never satisfying,  it's always disappointing, it's never ended well, it might be fun for a while,  It might feel good for a bit,  there might be monetary gains, there might be other gains, but it always ends tragically. And I'm tired of living a life of tragedy. Tragedy comes no matter what. I don't want to put myself in the position of being disappointed all the time. And any time I focus on myself, I find myself becoming very disappointed and very lonely. And so those are probably the two biggest factors outside of family and friendship that have made me go; OK, if I'm taking all of this into consideration, where are the right choices here and that's trying to make this about us and not about me. 

Ryan Alford [00:15:56] I love it a lot. There is a lot to learn there. I'm going to highlight clips for people to learn from because some people get that naturally, but not many. And so I admire you for holding true to your faith. Let's talk a little about The  Bachelor becoming big business,  from the influencer side, for every contestant, to engagement, to sponsorships, all those kinds of things. I'm in marketing, so I have always watched the show with that eye, which is probably a little different than the average person. But do you think the average person even recognizes the machine and the business that it is now? 

Ben Higgins [00:16:45] Now they do and you're hearing about it more and more, where people are getting criticized for not. The shows always had this really beautiful explanation for people's intentions. You're there for the wrong reasons. And I can't even say it anymore without laughing, because I hear so much in my other world, which is Bachelor focused. But it's a great way to explain it. And it used to be you're there for the wrong reasons just to have a good time. Now you're there for the wrong reasons to get the promotion and the fame and the monetary value. It's interesting for me to see the transition because people don't fully recognize it, I don't know the data to prove it, but I would imagine the monetary compensation now is tenfold to what it was 10 to 15 years ago because there are so many new revenue streams that influencers are being a part of. When I started on The Bachelorette, Instagram still wasn't a thing, it was just getting started. And so this conversation wasn't even being had. I don't remember anybody ever asking me; 'after this, what are you hoping to do or whatever?  I don't remember having that conversation. And so I was the bachelor. There was the bachelor. Instagram was out there, it was kind of the hot new social media thing, people were using it and people were paying for it. So I think I've gotten to see both sides uniquely, the pre influencers side of it and then the post, and I kind of walked the line in the middle and saw it from both ends. It is big business now, a lot of money gets poured into it, and rightfully so.  Social media is a very engaged audience. You get a lot of people following you. I think it's a scary proposition for some of these contestants to come on the show and go from zero to hero overnight and don't know that immediate fame is suffocating, it's paralyzing, and confusing. You can wake up one morning and have a million followers and lose yourself in the process because it goes from you just highlighting your life and sharing it with family and friends too; now ask yourself the question, how do I stay more relevant and how do I engage with my followers? And so your lifestyle starts to turn into that. You start to become a scary character. I think it gets hard for a lot of these people in all aspects. Now it's transferred over to sports, it's transferred to churches, it's transferred to executives, it's transferred everywhere now, and it's something interesting to study. 

Ryan Alford [00:19:33] Yeah. And, hey, I have a business idea. Bachelor boot camp. You could start it, like; here's how to manage all of it. Yeah, that's great. 

Ben Higgins [00:19:42] You know what, it can just be a phone call, but I love talking to any leads coming into the next season. I try to connect with each of them, especially the men, and just kind of give them some advice. I just want them to know that; hey, if I can do it, they can do it too, because it's really scary. They know what they're walking into and it's like; hey, take some deep breaths, you're going to be fine. You're going to survive this. And you'll probably thrive in ways you can't even imagine. 

Ryan Alford [00:20:14] So I know you're still involved like you said, you talked to guests, you come back to reunions, you're doing the almost famous podcast with Ashley where you all talk about it.  Are you embracing the opportunity to still have influence in and around the show? 

Ben Higgins  [00:20:40] Let's be honest,  life's been great for me post-show and  I've gotten to do a lot of cool things that I'm proud of, but I'm not naive enough to say that I would have the book out that we're talking about. I wouldn't be talking to you if it wasn't for that show. So I embrace it because I'm thankful for the show. Now, I know the show has its issues and I know some people like it. Some people hate it. I get that. I understand that. But I'm very grateful for the experience. I always will be. It's changed my life for the better. There are so many things I could ask myself. Would my fiance now have answered my direct message if she didn’t know I was on the show,  she would see the little blue checkmark and go, this guy can't be that creepy? I don't know. And so, yes, I want to stay involved until the show no longer wants me involved to try to give back what I can to something that did enhance my life. 

Ryan Alford [00:21:48] I love that man. I, speaking of love, like or hate, I mean, having been part of watching, I don't know if I ever said I'm part of Bachelor Nation.  Yes, I've admitted it now and I want Ben Higgins on my podcast, and my wife and I watch it then we're part of it. Not to get into the controversy, but Chris Harrison was a huge part of the show,  he was the pillar of the show. We loved Chris.  I don't have anything to say or judge about why or how everything transpired with him other than missing him already. Do you still talk to Chris? What's your relationship there? And how have you felt about all of that? 

Ben Higgins  [00:22:38] Well, you know, Chris is a great buddy of mine. He has been and I can't overstate how incredible he was and has been to me personally and in these years of my life as a friend outside the show, as somebody on the show, he was always kind of a comforting force to me, and I think he was that for most people. I think most contestants had a good relationship with Chris. You know, this has been weird. It's a weird season. I think there's a comfort to seeing him on the television because he's been there for 20 years. But for me, I  really really appreciate him. Now when it comes to this unique situation, it's a hard thing to process through, I think, for a lot of people, because they've seen him for 20 years, he's held himself well for 20 years. If there is one dude in Hollywood that could have gotten Hollywood, it could have been Chris. He never did. And he goes on an interview that was not handled well, there were some things said that if he could say differently or elaborate on more could have been perceived better. And if he didn't do it, it was a bad interview. Now, does that have to end where he's gone forever? I don't know. That's a very drastic move. But I do think that he is missed by many. And I do think that he was always respectful of the cast and the crew and he's still been respectful of me. I do get to talk to him every once in a while, he still reaches out, and I also would imagine Chris is taking a little break from anything relating to the franchise. I think it's pretty hard for him to watch this season from a distance. 

Ryan Alford [00:24:40] Just to close on that, do you think it's completely done, obviously for a little while, but I mean, you never say never, or do you have any inkling that he would ever be involved again? 

Ben Higgins [00:24:51]  I know I was there but I found out about his departure officially at the same time as everyone. I don't know any details of that. I don't know how somebody, who receives a severance and who has an ugly breakup can come back to a show in the same capacity that they were before.  At the same time,  Chris is 50 years old, he's had a really successful career. Does he want to? I don't know the answer to that. Does he want to come back? I feel like this was the end. If I was a betting man, I would say, yes, I think it's the end and I don't see a path where that can be reconciled, at least if I put myself into Chris's shoes and the show shoes. 

Ryan Alford [00:25:41] Fair enough. We'll just have to see how all you Bachelor fans out there react. To be continued, but maybe get used to the new normal.  I think the girls are doing as good a job as they can. 

Ben Higgins [00:25:55] Impossible situation for everyone. 

Ryan Alford [00:25:57] Impossible.

 Ben Higgins [00:25:58] They have half a fan base that is mad because they took his job, another half of the fan base is judging them like they've been doing it for 20 years, it's an impossible situation. But anybody would have said yes to that job. And I think they're doing a great job at it given the circumstances. 

Ryan Alford [00:26:20] Agreed Let's talk transition a bit like into your kind of entrepreneurial journey with the coffee business. What's it been like becoming an entrepreneur and managing businesses? How's that been going? 

BenHiggins [00:26:37] It's a roller coaster, buddy. As you know 3 1/2 years ago I  became a part of a nonprofit called Humulin Hope United, I was on the board and was in charge of fundraising, and at some point in time, we got tired of calling our friends and family, asking for money, and so my buddy and I who started the nonprofit went on a week-long trip. We rented a car in Central America and started driving, to talk through and to investigate ways that we could figure out how we can fund better or maybe even tell a better story. And one of the things we came up with was,  to sell a product that's universally consumed and that brings people together and can tell a story behind it and we agree to donate one hundred percent of the profits to nonprofits with the nonprofit specifically being Humulin Hope United. Generous coffee came on, so we decided on coffee. We sell coffee at generouscoffee.com. One hundred percent of the profits are donated to nonprofits. It's a passion project for me. It's still nothing that pays me a salary or income. It has a bunch of incredible people around it.  We have people in your area that are ambassadors that advocate for  Not too generous and we sell online, mostly we deliver to your door. It's been an incredible experience because of the things we've gotten to be a part of. It's been really hard because we're telling this story, we're donating this money and you would expect it to catch on like wildfire and spread but it's not been that easy, which has taught me a lot because, for a period of my life, a lot of things were pretty easy. This has been a humbling and exciting experience and I believe in it fully.  To all your listeners, thanks for asking, you can go to generouscoffee.com and order your coffee. Supporting generouscoffee.com  would be a huge gift. 

Ryan Alford [00:28:44] (This episode of the Radcast is brought to you by generouscoffee.com) Well leave the details in the show notes for everyone and it will get picked up. You know, we have an office full of coffee lovers and we'll get some ordered for the office as well. We'll even put in a subscription. Oh, you have a subscription service. We will promote the coffee for the next six months. At least we can do that. 

Ben Higgins [00:29:09] That would be incredible. It's you know, it's really fun because, with the subscription model, we do get to see the world become a better place. We do get to invest in these individual stories. We're focused on humans. We focus a lot on poverty alleviation and education and job creation. And it's been a magical ride, which is not always easy. And, yeah, it's my full-time job. I  don't know what my calendar looks like today, but I'm sure of something, that I'll be trying to sell coffee. So I guess I'm working right now, too. 

Rayn Alford [00:29:43] There you go. Well, if you need marketing help, you give us a call, you never know. What does the future hold, brother?. Where are we headed? I mean, we're embracing and staying involved with Bachelor. We've got generous coffee. We've got a book out. Where are we headed?  I know you're figuring that out. You're getting married, man. I mean, you know, the back fully concludes, as you said, you know 

Ben Higgins [00:30:08]  The future is really interesting right now. It is a season of transition. I'm investing a little bit more into things that I've always dreamed of being able to do. So I started another podcast called Hopes to Wins.  Hopes to Win is interviewing people around the world who have stories to share and allowing the audience and myself to learn from them and with them, asking them the ultimate question. Do they believe that hope still wins? If so, why? And if not, why not? That's been really fun. It just launched a month ago. That's something I want to continue to do for years of my life. And then this is kind of the clarity I have today that could change tomorrow. But for years of my life, I thought I was living for the last five years, especially when Jess wasn't around yet, starting things, creating things, finding new things to get involved in, and taking up my time. I created an apparel company that does print-on-demand apparel called MY FAN THREADS and that took off,  at the beginning, it took up some time, GENEROUS COFFEE, then MY FAN THREADS, HOPES TO WIN and the book  ALONE IN PLAIN SIGHT was there. I have a couple of restaurants here in Denver, so all this was surrounding me and I was just trying to fill my plate. Now, my clarity is that it's time to dove deep for whatever reason. That scares me a bit. For whatever reason, I'm hesitant to dig in and I think I've been masking that by saying I'm so busy with all this other stuff. And maybe I was or wasn't, I think everybody's busy at some level, but now it's time to dive deep and invest into these things and create with these things. So I think that's what the next season looks like. It is committing and maybe that's the next word for this year, I just came up with it. But commitment, I'm getting married and I'm going to commit to these businesses. I want to commit to my friendships and relationships. 

Ryan Alford [00:32:09] I love it. And let's change all those articles from breakdown to break through, brother. 

Ben Harris [00:32:18] That's right. I think that's what I always thought I was doing. Yeah, I guess it doesn't, really it's not as catchy 

Ryan Alford [00:32:24] As the downer sells man.  

Benn Harris [00:32:27]  And one thing I'd like to highlight is there have been many days during this refocusing where I've sat alone and felt so empty and so confused and disappointed and sad. And then there's been days where, as I sit in that, I'm learning something like, why am I feeling empty and sad? What is it that I'm missing? What is it that I'm reacting to mentally? And so I knew over time it would come to a breakthrough. Like I knew my life was not over. I knew this stuff was not ending. I knew excitement was not disappearing from my life and that joy was still entering and I just needed to focus on it for a bit. 

Ryan Alford [00:33:12] I love it. You got time for a final segment we do? It is called Rad or FAD. I will give you like one word or maybe multiple words, but a concept or a thing. And you can give a RAD or FAD  response to it. Your game?  It doesn't have to be one word; you can explain your answer if you need to.  First one; Tik Tok? 

Ben Higgins [00:33:40] I knew you were going to ask that, but it's Rad and I think it's sticking. 

Ryan Alford [00:33:47] Yeah, I agree. 

Ben Higgins [00:33:49] Which  sucks because I hate them 

Ryan Alford [00:33:53] Traveling to space with Jeff Bezos and or just space tourism. 

Ben Higgins  FAD 

Ryan Alford   Being the Bachelor  

Ben Higgins [00:34:06] Like is the show going to be around? 

Ryan Alford [00:34:08] I Was just overarching, I think you kind of answered it already. 

Ben Higgins [00:34:11] It's a Rad. Yeah. I mean, it has both seasons of Radness for me as I get married, I don't think my fiance right now is going to love it in five years if  I'm still talking about my time as The Bachelor. 

Ryan Alford [00:34:25] This is true. Smart. Hey, you're smarter than most guys headed down this path already. Indiana is a football school. 

Ben Higgins1 [00:34:33] Oh, Rad, we're going to stay on that. You got me fired up. Alan is one of the best humans alive. Everybody wants to play for him. If they don't want to play for him they should want to play him. We're getting four-star recruits, three-star recruits. We're going to come to five-star recruits. I am telling you that Indiana University is on its way. 

Ryan Alford [00:34:54] I love Alan is a coach. He's awesome. All right. What was our last one? Oh. Pop country music, 

Ben Higgins [00:35:04] I hope it's a Fad. I'm a big outlaw red dirt country fan, turnpike and Kinnane ragweed, and then you go back like the Whalen's of the world. I turn on country music now and it doesn't sound different, but it doesn't make my heart ache, it doesn't make me want to pour a glass of bourbon. It just makes you want to get off. 

Ryan Alford  [00:35:30] I love it, brother. Good answers. Good answers. Well, Ben, I appreciate it. I know You're a busy man, as we all are, but I appreciate you coming on. And, you know, I think we've done a human highlight commercial here for the most part. But I want to give you an opportunity. Where can everybody find everything? A lot of it's just kind of a central location for all your stuff. 

Ben Higgins [00:35:51] Yeah, my Instagram is the best place, Higginsnot Ben. You can go on there. And like I said, if you drink coffee in the mornings, we'd love to give you your coffee, read the book while you're doing it; Alone In Plain sight, and  If you need Apparel; My Fan Threads. I'm a very thankful man. 

Ryan Alford [00:36:17] Hey, I'm glad I went to talk to you, you've always been on the list and you handled yourself well.  As a fan my wife said; hey, can I get a picture with him? I'm like, honey, he's not going to be in the office. He'll be on screen. 

 Ben Higgins[00:36:44] Well hopefully one day then. 

Ryan Alford [00:36:46] No, I know.  When you get to South Carolina or you are in Nashville or something like that, let's grab a beer. Who knows. 

Ben Higgins [00:36:52] That's right. Well, thanks, man. I appreciate it 

Ryan Alford [00:36:54] Hey, guys, you know where to find us. Ben just said where to find him. We're at Radcast.com. I'm at Ryan Alford. I'm verified on all the channels you can look us up, find all the highlights, all the content, and keep up with everything in the Radcast. We'll see you next time.